The Chronicles of Curious Characters

EP3 Dirk
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Konrad: So you mentioned that you were retired and you were still busy with, other projects.

What's other projects you are, involved? currently,

Dirk: I'm spending quite a lot of time on Toastmaster, which is a public speaking organization I'm president of, the club that I've been a member of, for 20 years. The Bo Way Gales, which is happens to be the oldest Toastmasters club in, the whole of Europe.

it's a very nice atmosphere I find that we have at the club because what we do is we create a safe environment for people to practice public speaking and, it's really. Very gratifying to see people evolve and coming in rather shy. and then developing themselves and, going on perhaps to even contests and, and to hear that they also [00:24:00] use it at work, et cetera.

Dirk: And in my career it's also really, really helped me. So next to being the president of my club, uh, which I'm only for here, and then afterwards I'll take up an another task. I'm also what we call area director, which means I coordinate the work of, of several clubs and I organize, contests and trainings and and so that's an another part of my, what used to be my weekends and now weekdays that are occupied with that.

but it's also nice because again, you meet other people. You, you go on trainings abroad, You hear people with different kinds of speeches or different kinds of, um, personalities. So I think one of the things that throughout my whole career has been real, motivator is, learning new things.

Dirk: And that that's about learning new languages, learning how the computer works, learning, learning how a new [00:25:00] version of of software works, teaching people, how new things work and, therefore also developing myself as a public speaker has always also been, a source of, inspiration and motivation.

Konrad: You mentioned quite a few things, Toastmaster, meeting people, learning new things. Especially the, part of the meeting people, fits quite well in Luxembourg because I've been in Luxembourg for six years and before I came here, cuz I moved from the United States, quite specific place because it was Memphis, Tennessee.

So I call it in the middle of nowhere, especially for Europeans. But people were telling us, oh, Luxembourg is boring. Nothing is happening in Luxembourg. but I think their opinion was through the lens of other European countries, first of all. secondly for me, nothing was happening in Memphis. So anywhere else would be an interesting place.

but also [00:26:00] I see so many things happening in Luxembourg. I mean, there are so many cultural events. And, uh, lots of people from different parts of the world, not only Europe, uh, and every year there are always newcomers. Mm-hmm. , uh, experts coming to Luxembourg. So I think, well actually I wanted to ask you, what's your opinion, how, Luxembourg fits into all that, you've been doing and you enjoy on retirement?

Dirk: Yes. it's strange and these are, occurrences, which are something like in film sliding doors, you certain things happen, which put you on a certain track. And for me, I guess it was linked to my military service that I did in. From our law. I was always coming to see movies here, because here you would have the, the original English version with subtitles, whereas in our law you would have the dub French version, which was awful to,watch.

and [00:27:00] so I developed a link with Luxembourg. I was coming to, to the, what is now the library,which was then called the Cine Cite . so next to the Plaza, and there were other, there were two other cinemas next to the, the guy next to the train station. And then there was another one, very old with PO seats, etc, et cetera.

on the corner across from what is now the Zita clinic or, or however it's called now. So there was a lot of atmosphere there. They had in the same movies as. Uh, otherwise internationally. And they were even very often the, the Belgian version subtitled in both French and, and Dutch, because apparently for the Benex, uh, they used the same versions.

Dirk: And, and so when I did a competition for the commission, I was selected, I was offered a job, in Luxembourg. And so I [00:28:00] said, well, I know Luxembourg a little bit, so feels like a nice place. So let's, let's try it out. And, and like many people coming to Luxembourg, I said, well, okay, I'll try it out for a couple of years and perhaps then I'll go to Brussels and, uh, 32 years later I'm still here.

And, and because I think indeed Luxembourg is, is an international village and it's grown more international, with the years. I think in 1990 when I arrived, it was compared to now perhaps a bit more provincial. But then as of 1995, when it was European cultural capital for the first time, the cultural offer offer just exploded.

And then we got to fi and then Naoc. And I think currently there's, there's more than you can swallow. And on, on the cultural front,

you've been lux some work much longer than, than I have been. You just mentioned 32 years, uh, of your experience living, [00:29:00] uh, in Luxembourg. I'm still surprised when I sometimes look at, Google Maps and I want to see the street view of a certain, street.

Konrad: And I notice that that street doesn't look anything. Like I remember it from, let's say a couple of months ago. And then I look at the date of that street view and it's, for example, from 2008 and it already looks completely different. in your opinion, how did the Luxembourg has evolved? Has it evolved, evolved into something that, uh, that you like, that you expected?

how it has changed over the time for you?

Dirk: I think it's, it's probably surpassed my expectations. I didn't have any concrete expectations. to give you one example, one of the first years in the early nineties when I was at the commission, we, were involved in, were invited to look at a market of the future planning of the [00:30:00] Kirchberg.

And I said, well, this is,completely ir realistic. I mean, it's full of buildings. we were then in the building and you already had the, no hotel. Hotel. And they said, You can't possibly fit a building in front of the Novo Hotel and on the other side of the Novo Hotel. This just isn't space for that.

And now this is really there. full buildings and towers and half of that maquette has turned into reality. And whereas then, you had, you didn't have haw, you had, you had a, a Ford garage on the other side of Auchan. You had the nucleus of the, of on the Foire, on the Kirchberg.

and that was about all the buildings. You, you had, you had a building of, the Foyer the insurance company. and now indeed it's almost completely built up, but I think in a, in a quite intelligent fashion. And what I also like is that by and by. [00:31:00] Luxembourg has brought more real inhabitants because it used to be completely dead at night.

Dirk: It was only office buildings. and then they started with Auchan. And then, now, I mean, there's lots of,new building, and it's a really new quarters pushed up from, the ground. So I think Luxembourg has the advantage of being relatively small scale so that you can, you can program things, you can connect them, and, and there's also not too many levels involved compared to Belgium, which is like administratively is so complicated to get anything done.

it will take you decades. And here I think the administration is also much more efficient and there's, there's a lot of thinking. That goes into the development of a country,

Konrad: I think. And you partially mentioned that. Well, what's interesting about Luxembourg, and I noticed that also tourists are, [00:32:00] noticing that and are impressed, is that when, when you are in the city center, in the old town, you have that old town in front of you and you see the Kirchberg with all the new buildings.

And there is this dichotomy, the difference between all the new, and for me personally, somehow it fits in Luxembourg. I didn't see that in other cities, Brussels, uh, or, or anywhere else. Uh, but also maybe I'm biased because I live in Luxembourg and I enjoy the city. but yes, like you said, I think the, the way that the city management designed the city and introduced those.

old and new, and there is this heritage of old and they're very proud of it, which is great, and it's really well maintained. Mm-hmm. and open to the public, but also those new institutions, new buildings that Al are also very important part of Luxembourg because all the foreigners who come and visit Luxembourg, they, know [00:33:00] Luxembourg, not necessarily cause of its old town and the history, but they know it because of its financial center and also the, uh, one of the centers of the EU institutions.

Mm-hmm. . So I think it, it's very interesting city in that respect.

So you are, you are not, disappointed with the way that Luxembourg has evolved, right?

Dirk: No, not at all. to give you another figure, That years ago, I think might have been 15 or 20 years ago, in Toastmasters , somebody gave a speech about an article that had just, appeared in the,press and where somebody had said by, I don't know which year, perhaps 2050 or something, Luxembourg would have 700,000 inhabits.

And we were at 300,000, barely 300,000. In that moment, everybody, this is impossible, 700 more than double is never going to happen because we've grown from 250 to 300 and [00:34:00] because 10 years or something. and now we are at 640,000, and it's only 2022. So, it is amazing how, how all of these is, it is great to look back over, 30 years and see.

Well, and everything we thought well would never happen now is almost in place. And, and on the other hand, it took, for instance, a very long time, to make Luxembourg a bike friendly city. because there were never, ever any, there wasn't any particular space for cyclists. But then I think around 10 years ago, it changed when they also introduced these, Velo, rent, renter bike system.

And now I, I must say that it's, it's not bad. And I mean, one of the great examples is this cycling path underneath the port Adolph, which is, which is even a tourist attraction and which is so well, well made and then so [00:35:00] well integrated into, that whole system and that you have cycling lanes next to,the tram.

On the main road going to the station, the avenue in Liberte. So Luxembourg has really transformed itself, in a, in a very positive way, I find.

Konrad: And is there something for you that is still lacking Luxembourg, that you would like to, see?

Dirk: Well, , there's not enough water. . I mean, if you go to Finland, where my wife is from, which is full of lakes, and the only thing you, uh, you have the lake of Esch-sur-Sure, and you have, remission.

I used to do some wind surfing, uh, there, but I mean, you never have enough wind. You, you cannot go on the Mosel because there's, there's ship traffic, et cetera. But I think it's gonna be, even for Luxembourg, it's gonna be difficult to, to improve on that. Uh, once, um, a colleague [00:36:00] Toastmaster gave a very funny speech.

Dirk: He said, well, okay, we've come up with a solution for, for what people always say is lacking in Luxembourg, we don't have any sea. So actually we will just take all of Luxembourg, we will transport it to the vie and plot it in there on, on islands specially made for us. So we've solved this final problem, but I haven't seen the budget, uh, for this emerge yet.

Konrad: Long time ago, I think maybe at the beginning when I moved to Luxembourg, I heard a joke, an anecdote, I don't know, maybe it's true, uh, is that Luxembourg has the highest number of, ship vessels registered in, because of tax reasons. I never tried to verify if it's just a joke or if it's a true statement.

it does have, vessels on the Luxembourg flag. I don't know, how many compared to other ship faring nations such as Panama or something. But, it, that does exist. Yes.

Konrad: Okay. So it's, there is [00:37:00] a part, truth,

Dirk: truth, but I'm, I'm, I'm not sure whether it's, but it's much bigger than any other of these.

Konrad: Break for some tea. Sure. This is, uh, the noise from the neighbors. I dunno if you heard they were moving something before there. You didn't. Okay. I'm, I'm very, uh, sensitive to all the noise and I saw the cat was also here. Yes. I, uh,

Dirk: so he do some movement. But he was very, very,

Konrad: yeah, but he went, I I heard him owk in the other room were Magdas

Dirk: you, um, you still have a very good, uh, developed ear.

I, I, I start noticing that, that my hearing is not as, as good as in my twentie also

Konrad: start because I, I like to listen music in the, with the headphones and I find myself listening sometimes way too loud to it.

So [00:38:00] you mentioned Toastmasters and I wanted to ask a bit more about the Toastmaster. So you mentioned that the Toastmaster allows people to improve their, public speaking.

for you personally because I'm interested in your experience. what. Brought you to Toastmasters in the first place.

I was invited by a colleague of mine, and I was interested because it was around the time that I was involved in, it user groups.

Dirk: So I had to chair meetings, I had to talk to people, I had to make presentations, and I said, well, I could probably improve. And the thing I appreciated most is that, well, first of all, as I said, it's, it's a safe environment. You can talk about anything, it will not matter. and people give you constructive feedback.

And also what I noticed is that with practice, you get more confident. And [00:39:00] even when I'd been at Toastmasters already for. 10 or 11 years. When I was president of the club for the first time and I was opening meetings, I was actually astonished at how nervous I was standing, at the lectin and opening the meeting, which was, I mean, there was nothing about it.

but also that after I felt, after my first year sharing meetings, you learn, well, I'm actually okay at this. I'm actually good at this. And, a lot of the fear of public speaking, I think comes from not knowing how you react and from all of these imaginary pressure and also real wealth because I think even professional speakers, they tell me that they're still nervous before going on stage, but they have learned to accept that nervousness and seed as internal energy.

Dirk: Because it's an energy that says, I want to do a good job. And if you turn it around in this way, it really [00:40:00] reinforces your, your focus if you don't let it distract you, but just let it confirm that you are there to do a job. and something that has helped me also is the saying, own the stage.

You are there to do a job. You've been nominated to do the job. You are chairing the meeting. you've been invited as a keynote speaker. People look up to you. People want to hear something from you. they come with a positive vibe. So, it links with another thing we always say in Toastmasters, never apologize.

Because if you apologize that people say, well, why is he apologizing? Because I hadn't noticed until you apologized. and therefore, you are always much more nervous on the inside than people can see on the outside. So all of these things, once you start internalizing them, they rid you of excess fears, and you can use that nervous energy to really [00:41:00] then concentrate and do a good job.

So it's, it's about practice. It's about also mental preparedness. And once you've done this a number of times, you get into the habit of quickly reacting. and that brings me to another part of, what we do is impromptu speaking, which, which we call table topics. So, somebody will prepare some questions and then ask people to give an unprepared speech asking that question for two minutes.

And again, it's very good practice because it, it forces you to think on your feet to come up with something with a few idees to structure them and to close it off in a, in an elegant way. and I think that's actually been the part of Toastmasters that's even been more useful to me than giving speeches because how many times you give less real, real keynote speeches at work is not very often, but you're very often in meetings, [00:42:00] you very often ask questions either by a stakeholder or by your head of units or your director general, and then you don't want to sit there and stumble and having practiced this dis impromptu speaking as we helped me, perform there and.

I've even been, asked, to write speeches for my director general and even done one speech at the end of my career for my commissioner. So, and that's, that's very satisfying then, that you are asked because you are a Toastmaster, can you contribute to this?

Konrad: And Toastmaster is not only about, public speaking, it's on the one hand it's about, managing your own fear.

Uh, like you said, it's also, I think about managing, what you think that others expects from you, which is not quite often the reality because we tend to imagine ourself and coming up with those, expectations that others might have towards us. But it's also managing the [00:43:00] audience. . But there is also another aspect which we didn't mentioned.

I think it's also quite important, is the time management. Mm-hmm. . Because even the impromptu speeches, even the normal speeches, everything is timed there. So there is this additional pressure, so to speak, that you not only have to give the speech that you want to, everything be probably perfect, you have the audience in front of you, but there is this time management mm-hmm.

which adds additional, layer of, uh, pressure. I, I guess. has this time management, helped you in your professional career?

Dirk: Yes, because there's nothing worse, especially in meetings in big organizations than that someone speaking for too long. And it's really helped me to try and condense my speech, and also my interventions.

And not repeat myself. and if I have a [00:44:00] particular speaking slot in a, let's say, in a senior management meeting, to really stick to that because to be effective and to pass your message is very important that you stay within your allotted time. cause otherwise people get distracted. They start focusing on, on why you are going on and not on your real message.

So I think that's, and again, it's practice. I mean, I used to practice my speeches with the stopwatch at home and then the first time for five to seven minutes each, I'd end up at 12 minutes. Okay. Okay. Perhaps I'm not fluent enough. Okay. You do it next time. You end up at eight or nine minutes.

Okay. I have to cut out more stuff. Okay. Then you end up around the same thing. You few more things and then. So it's really craft han So, uh, it's, it's craft, its discipline and it's, it's focusingon the key messages.

Konrad: And with your, new role in the Toastmasters, which, is Area [00:45:00] director, um, what are your plans? Is there anything that you would like to introduce

Dirk: No, I think my, my focus as area director is rather help the clubs,

work towards more stability because many clubs have suffered also during covid because people didn't have the time and all the clubs moved to online and then hybrid. and many of the clubs are now not yet at the level. Of number of members they were before. So I think it's important for clubs to, to know how to present themselves, how to run themselves in a, in a good way, in an organized way, and get people in involved so that, that everybody can learn.

Because it's, if it's always the same three people who are giving speeches, then those three people will advance, but the others won't. and part of that is also organizing, contests, [00:46:00] which are not only part of the program, but contest is yet another challenge at another level that you set for yourself.

And the advantage of contest is that you would give a speech at your club, you would get feedback, you'd fine tune it, and then your club will send you out to represent it. At the area level where again, you compete against other speakers. So you, get challenged a bit more. You can find you in your, your speech a bit more, then you would go to division level, which in our case is, is Luxembourg Alsace and Lorraine..

And then if you make it at that level, you go to the, let's say half of Europe, so the Benelux and, France. And at each point you not only, not perfect your speech, but you also see other people doing things at the same level or probably even if a higher than you. So it's like in a marathon or a race, if somebody's running ahead of you and just a little above your level, he [00:47:00] actually will drag you, to that level.

And so, and that's always been very inspiring for.

Konrad: These days, many people are working from home because of Covid and how the whole industry, shifted. And they might think that because they work from home, they don't need to practice or learn public speaking, which I don't think is the case.

What, what's your take on

it?

Dirk: Yeah. I think if anything, being concise and fluent is even more important in online meetings because our span of attention is short because you miss part of the body language. You miss part of the, connection from sitting across people. You don't have, let's say the small talk when you come into the room, when you sit next to your neighbor, at the end of the meeting.

So you really have to be even more focused. And aware of your background [00:48:00] and your noise, your lighting, your camera, your body language and then, and also the way you speak. So I think the circumstances are different, but I think speaking in a focused and clear way is even more important in online meetings.

Konrad: And, does the club that you're involved in, allow people to practice speaking in public, but through the camera or online? conference systems

with the first covid lockdown, we immediately moved everything to Zoom. And so then we had to struggle and find out what works and even do contests and everything online.

and I think everybody built up a certain basic knowledge of what it is to be in an online meeting. , we had to switch to, to hybrid. And hybrid, as you're probably [00:49:00] aware, is even more, complicated because you basically have to deal with one audience live and another audience, and you need to make people visible.

Dirk: We solved that by buying just least expensive, TV screen that I could find in offshore. and then using that one laptop at the lector for the speaker, so the speaker can also see in, in gallery review all the, all the people online, and then you have good audio connection and then one laptop, which is turned towards the audience.

And, and chose the physical room. And I think with that we, we've established quite a good, setup. We also give people feedback, especially when they're, they're presenting speeches from home. We do an audio test. We tell them whether there's not enough light or it's distracting or their background, is not working, et cetera.

So I think we [00:50:00] now by default have hybrid meetings and it has allowed some very long-standing members of the club who are now based on the Crete or in Warsaw or in Dublin, or in Brussels. to rejoin the club and, and be a reckon part of our meetings. And so that's, that's really the added bonus that,

Konrad: That's very interesting. , evolvement, of the club, in Indeed, because of, like we discussed before, Luxembourg being a specific place of lots of people moving in and out. Every now and then, some of the members could have moved out, but now with this hybrid method, it allows them to rejoin and actively, give speeches, being in distance, from the club.

before we, we finish, I just want to mention to the listeners, if you're interested, we will include, with Dirk's permission, the link to his flicker mm-hmm. as well to the, Toastmasters club in the show notes. So you [00:51:00] can, go there and check out those two. Websites. Dirk, thank you so much for your time, for sitting down with me and having a very interesting discussion about your experience living in Luxembourg, your experience working, for the European Commission, and also talking about your passions.

Konrad: Uh, please, the two of them, I, I'm pretty sure there are much more. maybe you will get a chance to sit again together, in the near future and discuss more about different activities that you are busy with, in your retirement. Thank you so much, so much for coming over.

Dirk: Thank you for having me.